WHAT DID NEW YORK CITY REPRESENT FOR A YOUNG JAZZMAN? A PLACE TO BE?

When I was ten years old my parents decided to move to New York City from my birthplace of Jacksonville, Florida. Just after arriving, my mother entered me in the famous Apollo Theater “Amateur Hour”. During those, the early fifties, almost all contestants were singers. I was the only instrumentist ! But I placed at the top. The song I played ‘Because Of You’. Also during these years if you placed at the top, your reward was a work experience with the Red Prysock Orchestra.

WHAT WERE YOUR FIRST IMPRESSIONS OF THE CITY ? YOU LIVED AT FIRST IN HARLEM, THEN IN BROOKLYN: WHAT WERE THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THOSE TWO PARTS OF THE CITY?

Of course for a child that age schooling and getting to know the city occupied most of teenage years. Around eleven/twelve, my mother’s brother had a lot of hip LPs which I occupied myself listening to. I had already been doing that since the age of six/seven at home, in Jacksonville. My mother’s father had original 78 rpms Jazz At The Philharmonic presentations of Norman Granz, which I was already “scatting” to. So I knew what was hip and what was ‘has been’ by the age of eight, so amongst those LPs of my uncle I discovered Max Roach and Clifford Brown At Basin Street on EmArcy. I knew immediately that it was just about the hippest thing I’d ever heard and right there I made the decision that this would be my life’s work. So between eleven/twelve until graduation from high school at seventeen years of age, most of my working hours were spent listening to everything.

YOU PLAYED AS A SIDEMAN, AND FURTHER AS A LEADER, DURING THE SIXTIES… WHAT WERE YOUR MAIN INFLUENCES? JACKIE MCLEAN? MAX ROACH? DIZZY?

My main influence, until I found Clifford Brown, was Charlie Shavers at that point. New York’s Harlem where I grew up was a sort of paradise. From my house located on 137street & eight avenue, I was in walking distance of two main jam session spots : Count Basie’s bar and a place called Brankers. It was at those two places that musicians young and old came on Monday nights to be heard in the hope of getting in and being accepted into the scene. I didn’t participate yet, just listened. I went away to Washington, between eighteen and twenty one, but I decided in 1963 to return home because I felt I was ready to participate. My family had moved to Brooklyn and there was a club in that part of town named Blue Coronet where many soon-to-be major figures were playing. I too jammed there and one night I met a fella named Jim Harrison who had started his own Jackie McLean Fan Club. He told me that maybe Jackie McLean was looking for a new trumpeter and that I should go see him. He gave me his contact, and I went to meet him. The rest is history ! Without having barely, if at all, heard what he sounded like, Jackie put me on his next recording for Blue Note : It’s Time. That changed my life forever.

YOU WERE (WITH WOODY SHAW) ONE OF THE CATS ON TRUMPET… HOW COULD YOU EXPLAIN THE FACT RECORD COMPANIES DIDN’T OFFER TO YOU A GOOD DEAL?

For the next couple of years, I performed and recorded with Jackie. He was my mentor into the scene. It was also during this period that Alfred Lions sold his masterpiece, Blue Note Records, to Transamerica Corp/United Artist. Both myself and Woody Shaw had been placed on significant Blue Note recordings but for some reason Alfred Lions would not give us a record session of our own, which had been up to that point what usually happened with young lions trumpeters brought in by established stars within the label, and that is you would be given your own recording as leader. It would take Woody Shaw nearly five more years before he got his chance with Columbia, curtailing Dexter Gordon.

IN THE EARLY SEVENTIES, WHAT WAS THE PLACE OF JAZZ IN THE MUSIC BUSINESS? WAS IT HARDER AND HARDER FOR YOUNG MUSICIANS LIKE YOU?

One cannot be certain, but the last A&R guy of the original Blue Note label, Duke Pearson – himself trumpeter as well as pianist by the way – before Alfred Lions sold the company, perhaps didn’t push for us to record as leaders, as the A&R before him, Ike Quebec, did for Freddie Hubbard. Speaking of Freddie Hubbard, I first met him when he had just arrived to New York. I was seventeen, he was twenty one. Since that moment we were friends and confidants until his death.

THAT WAS WHY YOU DECIDED TO CREATE STRATA EAST?

With respect to recording contracts, it is as much about who in the business, A&R, managers, agents, record label execs, etc. will champion your cause and more often it is those elements more than your artistry which gets you there. As mentioned Woody Shaw, as good as he was, had to wait until the mid seventies before being championed. I decided in 1970 to just go ahead and get involved with the whole process; being a musician artist, composing, arranging, and issuing my recordings with a company I would create. I had already in 1969 made my first LP as a leader for Alan Bates while he was still an executive at Polydor in London, “The Ringer”, featuring my first quartet which included Stanley Cowell.

COULD YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT YOUR PARTNERSHIP WITH STANLEY COWELL ? HOW LONG YOU HAVE KNOWN HIM FOR? WAS HE A KIND OF ALTER EGO? HOW DID YOU WORK TOGETHER?

Stanley Cowell and I met for the first time at the first rehearsal to start the new Max Roach quintet in 1967. From That moment until now we became close friends and confidents. Three years later we decided to record a big band and shop it to the labels that existed at the time, including the major indies. We didn’t find interest, so right then and there I decided we do the whole “9 yards” ourselves. There was not yet the thought of a record label, just get this recording “Music Inc & Big Band” into the market.

WHY DID YOU CHOOSE THIS NAME STRATA EAST? WHAT DOES IT MEAN?

To make a long story short, researching everything about how the industry companies did it, we went about the business of record (LP) in manufacturing of distribution. We didn’t have a name for the label yet, but Stanley knew some musician colleagues in Detroit, Michigan – The Contemporary Jazz Quintet, Kenny Cox/Charles Moore – who had already started a musician-owned music production company named Strata. We decided to call our operations Strata East, meaning the eastern side of the USA for Strata. We were completely separate companies but ideologically linked : “musician owned”. Strata East was born.

WAS IT A KIND OF COOPERATIVE ? ALTERNATIVE? AND DID YOU CHOOSE WHO YOU SIGNED?

Back to making a long story shorter : the jazz radio disc-jokeys at a radio station at the time WLIB started playing the LP and we slowly started getting small orders from “Mom & Pops” one-stop distributors, and we also distributed through another musician run company JCOA headed by Carla Bley and Mike Mantler which lasted for several years. Other musicians, some known, some unknown, began asking how we did it and could they join. I decided there would be no artist under contract. The artist would have to produce his own product just as Stanley and I had. We, Strata East, would serve as their conduit to the market place with 70/80 payback to them. IT WAS A GOOD DEAL… Some people thought it was a crazy idea… The traditional thought being that if you start a record label – and you want to make money – you put an artist under contractual control. I and Stanley decided that since out of necessity we had financed our LP which launched the label, we not only owned the masters but if we let others join so too would they own their masters since the requirement to join was them having already financed their recording thus become the major recipient of the proceeds. The result of this idea didn’t really become apparent until we issued Gil Scott-Heron’s “Winter in America”.

SCOTT-HERON, CLIFFORD JORDAN, CECIL MC BEE, HEATH BROTHERS… WHAT WAS THE LINK BETWEEN ALL THESE MUSICIANS?  WAS THERE A SORT OF ARTISTIC DIRECTION? ESTHAETIC LINE?

Prior to Gil Scott-Heron’s product, the artist who really contributed much to the Strata East formula was Clifford Jordan who in essence had already busied himself with producing at least four products which he was to bring to the label. Then many of our colleagues joined : like you mentioned, the bass player Cecil McBee, the brotherhood Heath –Jimmy, Percy and Tootie –, Bill Lee, Spike’s father, the Monk’s saxophonist Charlie Rouse, Billy Harper and many others…

YOUR EXPOSURE CHANGED AFTER THE SUCESS OF WINTER IN AMERICA. HOW MANY RECORDS DID YOU PUT OUT ON STRATA EAST IN THE END?

With the success of Scott-Heron, the “major recipient” idea quickly caught until at one point we were carrying fifty titles through 1982. From the inception of Strata East in 1971 until 1982 I kept things going while still performing both with the quartet and occasionally with large ensembles. I kept the label going by leasing to many companies throughout Europe, Scandinavia and Japan. By doing so the LPs always found their way back to America and into the retail store that were alive in those hey days, I.C., Tower, HMV, etc.

MOST OF US ARE FASCINATED BY THE STRATA EAST RECORD LABEL. THERE IS ONE PARTICULAR RECORD FROM THAT CATALOGUE THAT HAS REMAINED MYSTERIOUS TO US. IT’S JOHN GORDON’S “EROTICA SUITE” FROM 1978. CAN YOU TELL US ANYTHING ABOUT THIS RECORD?

John Gordon & I became colleagues in a loft we shared around the corner from the storied 89 East Broadway loft both of which were a vital part of the mid-sixties loft jazz scene melting pot for new modern be-bop players and new avant garde players. Some years after Stanley & I got the label going John decided to join and the result was his “Erotica Suite” (and before that “Step By Step” published in 1976) which we also performed on. It is still a recording I very much enjoy. Sadly John passed away some years ago.

GENERALLY SPEAKING WHY ARE SOME OF THE STRATA EAST RECORDS SO RARE? I THINK ABOUT BILLY PARKER’S FOURTH WORLD, SHAMEK FARRAH, MBOOM PERCUSSIONS…

Generally speaking many of the Strata East recordings are rare now because they were one-off recordings by the artist who afterwards disappeared from the scene never to return. Billy Parker (Fourth World) and Shamek Farah by example. In the case of MBoom the anticipated release on Strata East never materialized because the participants decided to release it elsewhere. Mboom was a collective group essentially all leaders of it.

WERE COPIES DESTROYED OR WAS THERE JUST NO ENOUGH BELIEF IN THEIR COMMERCIAL SUCCESS AT THAT TIME?

Any LP copies of commercially released Strata East recordings were never destroyed. At the end of a deal with any particular artist that artist was given their masters and any LPs that may have been left in stock to sell for themselves. No deal was ever made with any artist based on whether or not it would be a commercial success. It was made because the artist wanted and needed to have a product commercially issued and came to us to help them accomplish that. Obviously some were more successful than others.

BY THE WAY, YOU STILL LISTEN TO YOUR OLD RECORDS? ON LP?

Rarely do I listen to my own vintage LPs because I don’t want to damage them with the needle. I do from time to time listen to them on CD issues.

AND WHAT WAS HAPPENING AT THE END OF THE SEVENTIES? WHY DID THE STRATA EAST ADVENTURE FADE AWAY? YOU DISAPPEARED DURING THE EIGHTIES BUT YOUR NAME AND THE STRATA EAST LABEL WERE STILL WELL KNOWN BY MUSIC LOVERS…

After 1982, I decided to rest things for a while. Strata East never ceased ! As long as I am alive it lives. The cult thing about the label started to happen long before the demise of the LP because I operated very quietly, no fanfare. So people were always wondering what happened to Strata East. Well, it wasn’t the traditional record operation although it facially had the look of an up and running operation. In 1989 I retooled the masters of myself and Stanley and a few other original colleagues of the label, and reissued some twenty five recordings of the catalogue on CD. Those CDs found their way to the market exactly as I had done before, by leasing overseas and they found their way back to the USA stores. Younger musicians and entrepreneurs who have taken a look at the Strata East model are now issuing their recordings with that model in mind. You own your own master and you should be the “major recipient”.

(c) Jimmy Katz

BACK TO THE EIGHTIES. IT WAS A NEW AGE OF JAZZ : WYNTON MARSALIS, AND YOUNG TRADITIONNAL CATS ; HOW DID YOU LOOK AT THIS PHENOMENA? A KIND OF COME-BACK TO THE PAST? A FAKE IDEA?

With respect to a new age of jazz unless newer musicians have assimilated the original giants, what is called new age means nothing. And one can hear that in a lot of them. I’m not unhappy with the state of things however for there are a few of us still “taking no prisoners” on the bandstand keeping things honest. The superiority of the originals still reigns supreme.

LAST BUT NOT LEAST, YOU PLAYED IN JAZZ AT LINCOLN CENTER END OF OCTOBER 2011 FOR A TRIBUTE TO COLTRANE’S AFRICA BRASS…

The Africa Brass thing is an idea of Reggie Workman. The original scores by Eric Dolphy were long ago lost. I resurrected them from the grooves of the LPs and created additional choir to it. This was presented like that at Lincoln Center.

DO YOU THINK, AFTER ALL THOSE YEARS, THE HOLY GHOST OF COLTRANE STILL HAUNTING ALL THE JAZZ?

You know, John Coltrane still is and will always be the last definitive model for this music, far superior to the brand new generations. And I have always been on the disciples to carry that enduring message.

YOU CAME BACK AFTER TWENTY FIVE YEARS IN FRONT OF JAZZ ON BLUE NOTE RECORDS, THE LABEL WHERE YOU BEGAN TO RECORD IN SIXTIES… HOW DO YOU LOOK AT THIS LOOP? AND WHAT DID IT CHANGE AFTER ALL THOSE YEARS?

Lastly, I did the recent Blue Note to prove a point. A major record operation if it so chooses – that is, follow the wishes of its president – can make any recording FLY. Not even Bruce Lundvall (former boss) could save the original intent of Blue Note once EMI was monopolized by Terra Firma.

YOU ARE CELEBRATING YOUR FIFTIETH CAREER ANNIVERSARY IN 2014. WHAT STAGE PROJECTS DO YOU HAVE?

For the coming 2014 celebration of my fiftieth year I will perform on stage as I began my career with the small combo format, quartet and sometimes quintet. It is where I have always lived no matter my occasional run with the big band format. First I will be introducing my new combo featuring a great relatively new guitarist Bruce Edwards, a great new young pianist Theo Hill, a great new young bassist Devin Starks, and the great seasoned former Herbie Hancock drummer Gene Jackson.

FOR THIS ANNIVERSARY, WOULD NOT IT BE THE OPPORTUNITY ALSO TO PUBLISH A BOXSET OF YOUR ACTIVITY ON STRATA EAST? FOR INSTANCE ON MOSAIC?

Mosaic and Strata East have released two 3CDsets of me which one could say is like a boxset together : Mosaic Select 20 which is a combination of “Live at Slugs Vol. I & II” and “Live in Tokyo”, and Mosaic Select 37 which is a combination of three recordings – the 1970 recording which launched Strata East, “Music Inc & Big Band” (See here TV Show jazz session in Paris 1971), the 1975 big band recording “Impact”, and a 1979 recording made with the NDR radio jazz orchestra. We’ll see what else we collaborate on for the near future.

COULD WE IMAGINE A TOUR IN DUET WITH STANLEY COWELL?

At some point during the year perhaps my colleague Stanley will join me to reprise the quartet Music Inc.

DID NEW YORK CHANGE AFTER ALL THESE YEARS?

New York indeed has changed since I debuted in 1964. For one thing only a handful (if that) of the original modern jazz innovators and the generation before me are still alive. New players like when I came along could rub shoulders with those giants every night because there were so many of them playing the New York club scene. You could hear and see them live, meet them, and maybe get a chance to perform with them if they liked what you were doing. The scenario for that has changed.