Bassist Cecil McBee is currently touring with The Cookers, an All Stars band featuring Billy Harper, Eddie Henderson, George Cables, Billy Hart, Donald Harrison and paying tribute to Freddie Hubbard’s eponymous Blue Note LP. But he has been putting his own footprints on Jazz history for a long time: as a composer first and also as a musician. And if he’s only recorded a handful of LPs under his own name, these LPs for such respected labels as Strata East as well or India Navigation have become real classics for spiritual jazz lovers.. We are very proud to publish this (too brief) interview with one of our heroes.

 
 
 

You’re touring with The Cookers, the type of group you often participated in (The Leaders for example …). What pleasure do you find in this kind of summit meeting?
That I’m participating in creating some of the world’s most powerful music. Unlike what I generally am exposed to these days.

Between you all how many years of experience, albums recorded?
The Cookers have over 300 years of experience combined and have performed on over 1,000 albums combined.

Your are 80 years… Do you remember your professional debut? What brought you into music?
When I was 17, I performed with a blues singer named Jimmy “Cry Cry” Hawkins in my hometown of Tusla, Oklahoma. The blues got me off to a good start. I started on the clarinet when I was in middle school and showed a certain proficiency on the instrument. I began playing bass as well when I was 17 years old. Because of my skills on the clarinet, I went to college at Central State University in Ohio as a music major. While there, I got exposed to a lot of Jazz for the first time.

Later, you played on stage in Detroit. What was so special about that scene in the 1960s?
I was invited to move to Detroit by Kirk Lightsey who I had met while in the Army. We both performed together in the Army band on clarinet. After we were honorably discharged from the Army, we moved to Detroit and I met all the great Detroit musicians who would inspire to get to the next level over the next few years.

New York was something else, right? Do you think you experienced something unique in the 1970s?
New York was wonderful and from the moment I arrived, it was an extremely unique experience for me. However, I must add that from the very moment I arrived in New York I found myself performing at the highest level with some of the world’s greatest musicians such as Herbie Hancock, Wayne Shorter, Jackie McLean and Charles Lloyd etc etc.

Mutima from “Mutima” (Strata East)

You even have actively participated in the experience of an independent label : Strata East. What was the philosophy behind it? Is it something still possible nowadays?
The philosophy was simply that on all accounts we would take ownership entirely of our music and at the highest level of business. This sort of thing is still possible today with a bit of hard work and insight and the willingness of musicians to work together for a greater good.

You were part of the Strata-East tour last year with Charles Tolliver and Stanley Cowell (with great gigs in Paris and London). Is it gonna be a following on this? More dates, a new album…?
It was nice to see the guys again. We plan to do a few more dates in the near future.

Jackie McLean and Yusef Lateef, Pharoah Sanders and Sam Rivers, Anthony Braxton and Horace Tapscott … Among all these stars you played with, who impressed you the most?
They all impressed greatly and in different ways. They were all of great importance to me.

What are the essential qualities of the so-called sideman? The listening? The sense of collective? The will to serve?
I don’t consider myself a sideman but an equal partner in the creation of this music. I have also know that I have a lot to contribute to this music as a bandleader and composer and being labeled as a sideman keeps me from getting the proper exposure I believe my music deserves.

The Cookers…

‘Consequence’ from “Alternate Spaces” (India Navigation)

Your album “Alternate Spaces” on India Navigation is one of our favorite! Can you give us details about the recording session?
“Alternate Spaces” to this day has been one of the albums I’m most proud of. The complex nature of the compositions introduced quite realistically a more in depth natural quality of who I am as a composer. It was India Navigation label that respectfully provided an open door for me to showcase where I was as a composer at the time. I felt entirely individual in my effort to be my own voice for the first time.

Will we be lucky enough to have another opportunity to listen a new album under your name after all these years?
I have completed many original compositions that I feel would make a great CD. However it takes a lot of time to properly prepare to record my music and I also need the right collaborators to fully realize this project. The goal is to record again in the future and I hope to realize this soon.

Thanks to David Weiss, Tom Woods and all New Morning’s crew!

What did Miles Davis, Salvador Dali, Jackie Kennedy, Leonard Bernstein, Andy Warhol, Timothy Leary and Brigitte Bardot have in common? Mati Klarwein, the painter who realized the mythical LP sleeves for ‘Bitches Brew’ and ‘Live Evil’ (Miles), ‘Abraxas’ (Santana) and so many others like Jimi Hendrix, Earth Wind and Fire, the Lats Poets, Jackie McLean, George Duke, Hermeto Pascoal, Eric Dolphy, Jon Hassell, Muddy Waters and Jerry Garcia… His colorful paintings have been used for numerous LPs, across all types of musical genres. They are a testimony of his totally special link to music, as underlined it the splendid book published in 2012 by Antoine de Beaupre : Mati and The music, a sort of “catalogue raisonné” about an unreasonable artist!

Mati Klarwein was born on April 9th, 1932, in Hamburg. He was from a family of artists : his father was an architect of the Bauhaus and his mother, an opera singer. But when the Nazis took power, the family had flee to Israel. During the post-war years, the young man settled in Paris, where he crossed path with Fernand Léger, Salvador Dali and Ernst Fuchs. They would become three pillars for his future works. At that time, he even tried jazz with Boris Vian, a writer and trumpet player, before crossing the Atlantic. In New York, Mati Klarwein added Abdul to his name, in support of the Palestinians. In the Mecca of jazz, he became known for being at the heart of the “flowery revolution”. He became an icon of the hippy generation by illustrating some of the most famous records of their most emblematic period. “I take nothing when I paint. When I am on drugs, I become really hot and I prefer to leave for nightclubs. On the other hand, I find most of my ideas when I am broken up well! Speaking about drugs can be as interesting as speaking about sex. Everything depends on who is expressing themselves. William Burroughs or Nancy Reagan.” Explicit lyrics.

The fact remains that the eminently sensory paintings of Mati Klarwein, between hallucinated surrealism and psychedelic naturalism, make spring kaleidoscopic colors, mythological characters and incredible landscapes, a vision of the world fed by the nature which he appreciated through his numerous trips the world over. During one of his journeys, he discovered Deia, a village nested in the nature of the Balearic Islands where, after several stays, he chose to settle down while the world was turning itself to other trends : yuppie, the Wall Street trader. That is where he decided to live, out of this world, without ever stopping painting, accompanied by his ghetto blaster, organizing hallucinated parties, where percussions became an invitation to shaman trances. He died there on March 7th, 2002.

A song for your trip…

The finest in jazz since 1939 ! This slogan is a trademark. In celebration of the 75th anniversary of Blue Note Records, YellowKorner pays tribute to Francis Wolff, the co-founder with Alfred Lion and in-house photographer of the prestigious record label, by publishing an amazing photo book and presenting a series of exclusive images seen through the lens of this master of jazz photography. From 1941-1965 Francis Wolff took thousands of photographs during the rehearsals and recording sessions that participate Blue Note Records legend.

Numerous portraits of legendary musicians as Art Blakey, Dexter Gordon, Herbie Hancock, Clifford Brown, Ornette Coleman, Wayne Shorter and many more, during record sessions, but also many pictures of these jazzmen in the city. All of them contributed in no small part to the success of the New York label. Mostly reproduced on the covers of the Blue Note discs, these powerful black and white shots gave a strong visual identity to the label, in connection with the unique designer Reid Miles. A myth was born.

YellowKorner further supports the importance of this anniversary by publishing 1939 copies of a hitherto unpublished work, written by Michael Cuscuna and telling the story of the creation and the dynamism of this historic label. Individually numbered and signed by Wayne Shorter, this superb collector’s item includes a collection of 150 exceptional Blue Note photographs taken during recording sessions.

http://www.yellowkorner.com/books/1652/blue-note.aspx

 
 

Since the late 60’s, the native from Connecticut has played an important role in jazz history. After hosting a radio jazz show and writing for ‘Down Beat’ and other music magazines, he started working for record companies : Atlantic, Motown, ABC, Freedom and finally… Blue Note. Since 1984, Michael Cuscuna has been a special consultant, producer and the reissue director of the mythical label… During the same period, he also managed Mosaic Records, the indie company well known for its reissue boxsets of jazz legends.

 
 

Before directing Blue Note, you worked for various labels such as ESP, Muse, or ABC … Is Blue Note the label you dreamed of working for?
There were two labels that I dreamed about working for – Atlantic and Blue Note. I was a staff producer for Atlantic in 1972-74. I was friendly with a lot of jazz musicians and many of them told me about great Blue Note sessions that they played on that had never been released. I started to keep a notebook with all of their memories and tried to contact Blue Note to get into the vaults to see what might be worth releasing. But George Butler was running Blue Note and his interest was not in jazz. The label had changed and was nothing like the old Blue Note. Finally in 1976 I met Charles Lourie who had just joined Blue Note and he was a great jazz fan. He got me into the vaults and I have been working with this material ever since.

What lays behind the identity of Blue Note? What makes the difference, gives it a different edge compared to other Jazz labels? The Pop dimension?
What gave Blue Note the creative edge and made it better and different than most labels is that Alfred Lion and Francis Wolff were interested in keeping jazz pure, BUT ALSO in helping to create a situation in which to make great jazz, they befriended artists, they had planning meetings and rehearsals and tried to encourage musicians to compose and make new music that they would be proud of. The difference was in the care and hard work they put into everything.

Do you think the history of Blue Note can be split in several periods? If so what are they and why?
The different periods of Blue Note are basically defined by the style of music they recorded at the time. The first period is 1939-46 when they recorded boogie woogie, New Orleans jazz and small group swing. The second period is 1947-54 when they discovered modern jazz and made great first sessions by Thelonious Monk, Art Blakey, James Moody, Kenny Drew, Wynton Kelly, Lou Donaldson and Horace Silver. 1954-67 is the period when Blue Note discovered its identity through sound (Rudy Van Gelder), design (Reid Miles), photography (Francis Wolff), production (Alfred Lion) and the style of the music (Horace Silver, Art Blakey with the birth of the Jazz Messengers). In this third period, the music grew and changed but it was basically the same creative team and the growing group of great musicians who recorded with the label, moving from soul jazz to hard bop to modal to avant-garde. Alfred Lion left in 1967 and Francis Wolff and Duke Pearson tried to keep the identity of Blue Note going until Frank’s death in 1971. The fourth period is the 70’s when George Butler ran the label. Some older artists like Horace Silver, Bobby Hutcherson and Elvin Jones stayed for a while, but the label’s sound was mainly controlled by the Mizell Brothers and Larry Rosen & Dave Grusin who were turning out successful, commercial albums by Donald Byrd, Earl Klugh and others. The next phase would be from 1985 when Bruce Lundvall restarted Blue Note to 2010 when he retired. In that era, we recorded a variety of music so it is hard to define what we have done. This is a different time.

To try and study the history of Blue Note, its evolution and singular aesthetic may sometimes sound like trying to understand the history of jazz. Why do you think this is?
Alfred Lion and Francis Wolff were jazz fans and they followed the music as it grew and changed. It is natural that people as smart and talented as them would mirror the evolution of the music in what they did. Sometimes they were followers like when they discovered bebop two years after other labels were recording it and sometimes they were the creators of change like when they signed Jimmy Smith before the organ was a jazz instrument and before the popularity of soul jazz.

Why do you think Blue Note succeeded in bringing together so many different artists, from Ornette Coleman and Cecil Taylor to Lou Donaldson and Lonnie Smith, without losing its originality and unity?
That is the key behind Blue Note. You could go from Ike Quebec to Jackie McLean to Lonnie Smith to Ornette Coleman and what is common about each artist is that they were making their best records for Blue Note. The sound, the packaging, the planning – it all makes each record special in the sense of Blue Note quality. We tried to do that in the 80’s. 80’s and 00’s. But of course we had different engineers, producers, studios and designers so we did not have the consistency that Alfred and Frank had.

What was the essence behind the fascinating Blue Note artwork? What kind of directions were given to the graphics designer to achieve such a harmonious and unique series of design?
This is very interesting. The early Blue Note designers like Paul Bacon and John Hermansader were modern designers and jazz fans. But by the time of the 12” (30 cm) LP, they settled on Reid Miles as their designer. Reid only liked classical music so he never listened to any of the hundreds of Blue Note albums that he designed covers for. And yet, he captured each album perfectly. The reason is that Alfred, who was a very enthusiastic and talkative man, would describe to Reid the spirit and intent of each album and Reid created the ideal design for each one. He also had that rare gift that every album cover looked different from the rest, but together they all looked like Blue Note covers.

There are some musicians that were all about Blue Note in their style but never got a release on the label like Mal Waldron or Charles Tolliver. What criteria did you mainly use to select your artists?
Well, Mal Waldron never recorded for Blue Note in any session, but I understand your question. Charles Tolliver and Woody Shaw were promised contracts with Blue Note but when Alfred sold the label to Liberty Records and didn’t like the way they were doing business, he told Charles and Woody that he didn’t want to sign new artists because he wanted to leave the label himself. Others like James Spaulding are a mystery. I asked James once why he never made a Blue Note album as a leader. He said, « They never asked me. » Well, James is a shy guy and probably he never asked them either! There is no logic to all of this.

Blue Note is by far the most collected and famous jazz label. Are you familiar with all the pressing details (the ear, the R, the deep groove, the flat edge etc …) that make it such a fascinating record series to collect and what is your opinion about it? And how did so many pressing variances occur?
I don’t know all the ins and outs of the collector details for Blue Note. Fred Cohen who runs the Jazz Record Center in New York City published a whole book about it. I am amazed at how collectable original Blue Note pressings and all the attention paid to little details like the label address on the pressings etc. By the way, the ear in the wax that collectors talk about is actually a P for Plastylite, the pressing plant that pressed all the Blue Notes in the 50’s and 60’s.

During the 90’s, Blue Note Japan reissued a number of previously unreleased sessions on LP including material by Jackie McLean, Andrew Hill, Bobby Hutcherson, Dexter Gordon, Lee Morgan, Wayne Shorter… Most of these recordings are awesome. Why weren’t they released at the time? Do you plan to release new issues of those recordings for the rest of the world?
Actually, in 1976 I started going into the Blue Note vaults for unissued material. I was amazed at the quality of a lot of it. Some artists like Lee Morgan and Grant Green recorded so frequently (probably because they wanted to earn more money) that the label could never put out everything, but much of what they did not release was every bit as good as what they did release. Both Lee and Grant were very successful so Alfred and Frank probably leaned towards their more commercial sessions to release at the time. Others are a great mystery like Wayne Shorter’s ‘Et Cetera’ or Bobby Hutcherson’s ‘Oblique’. Brilliant sessions. I asked Alfred once about all the unissued material and he didn’t really remember leaving so much good material in the vault. So I started putting these sessions out in the late ‘70s in the US. But the record business was in bad shape at the time and the label lost interest in issuing them. So I talked to King Records in Japan who were distributing Blue Note at the time. They put a lot of them out. Then when Toshiba EMI took over Blue Note we put more out and then started converting everything to CD. I have gotten just about everything out that deserves to be released at least in Japan if not everywhere. In the past few years, Japan has begun to reissue of lot of these and classic Blue Notes on hi-res CDs.

Our favorite recordings on the label belong to what we call the « Dark Jazz » genre, like Duke Pearson’s ‘The Phantom’, Andrew Hill’s ‘Lift With Every Voice’, Bobby Hutcherson’s ‘Oblique’ or Jack Wilson’s ‘Easterly Winds’! These are still largely underrated. Any idea why?
Well, most of the albums that you name are from the late 60’s and early 70’s. This was a bad time for jazz in USA. Underground FM Rock like Jefferson Airplane and the Grateful Dead were attracting the young white audience and the avant-garde was driving away the middle-aged black audience and jazz was left with very little support. These albums were created and issued during that time and were overlooked. I think that is why history has forgotten them.

Pete La Roca’s ‘Basra’ is one of our favorite LPs on the label. Why did Pete release only one LP for Blue Note?
I don’t know. A lot of guys only made one or two albums for a label during that time. And guys like Pete (in demand drummers and bassists) got a lot more work by playing with different groups than trying to lead their own group. Of course, Pete did make another album for Blue Note 30 years later !!!

75 years is quite an achievement! How do you explain the longevity of the label?
I think the longevity of the label is owed to the great music of the classic Blue Note period (1954-67) that Alfred and Frank recorded and that remains vital and alive today and the fact that Bruce Lundvall, myself and Don Was who followed since the 80’s have never tried to duplicate what they did, but we respect it and try to live up to their legacies in our own way.

The Blue Note identity (the artwork, the quality of recordings, …) is part of the label’s mythology. Do you have any type of strategy to keep the myth alive?
Well, we’ve always kept that legacy alive by issuing the classic Blue Note albums in the best possible sound with original packaging and liner notes to keep the spirit of the original Blue Note alive. That identity does not exist for new Blue Note recordings since 1985 because we have so many different producers, engineers, photographers and designers. We have always tried to keep the quality high, but it doesn’t have an identity like the original Blue Note did.

What could eventually endanger the Blue Note brand?
What would endanger Blue Note would be if the kind of person who only cared about music as a commercial commodity instead of an art were to take over the label. Then bizarre projects like Rod Stewart sings Gershwin or Barry Manilow duets with dead people would destroy the integrity of the label and lose the trust of the fan.

Do you think a label like Blue Note could see the light today? If so, which other label could potentially look like Blue Note today?
Yes, I do. But it would have to be an independent label, not part of large corporation. I think in the 70’s ECM in its own musical style created an independent label with a very strong identity. I think Criss Cross in the 80’s till today is doing very much what Blue Note of the 50’s and 60’s did. And newer labels like Palmetto and ACT are recording pure jazz and forging their own identities.

Are you interested in the current jazz scene?
Yes, I don’t have the time to follow it as much as I would like but there are an amazing amount of talent artists on every instrument. I think the fact that people like Herbie Hancock and Terence Blanchard give their time to jazz education has really helped too.

Current Blue Note artists like Gregory Porter or Robert Glasper are very promising. Do you think they will be part of the Blue Note legend one day?
Yes I do. We have been very lucky over the past 30 years to record people like Dianne Reeves, Cassandra Wilson, John Scofield, Greg Osby, Tim Hagans, Joe Lovano, Jason Moran, Ambrose Akinmusire, Robert Glasper and Gregory Porter. They are all original and they are here to stay.

Are you enthusiastic about the return of vinyl records? How do you see the future in that respect?
I don’t think the return of vinyl affects the style or quality of music, but it does make us more conscious of upholding great sound quality when producing a record.

We owe you the re-discovery of the Monk quartet with Coltrane. Do you have many more unreleased tapes? Where do you find them?
Well, they come from different places. That one came from Larry Appelbaum at the Library of Congress. Author Lewis Porter found an ad for that concert in a New York newspaper and kept asking Larry to look for it in the Voice Of America radio tapes. A couple of years later, Larry found it by accident !!!! They called me and we made a deal. This was a major find. I doubt we will ever see anything that significant again. I believe most of the next discoveries will come from INA, the BBC, RAI and other European radio and television companies that taped the great American artists in the 60’s.

What would be the Blue Note release of your dreams?
I don’t know how to answer that. Since 1976, I’ve gotten all the great unissued music released. Since 1985, I’ve gotten all of the classic catalog issued on CD in good sound with bonus tracks. I’ve also been able to produce a lot of wonderful artists like Andrew Hill, McCoy Tyner, Freddie Hubbard, Don Pullen-George Adams, Joe Lovano, Terence Blanchard and more. I think my dreams have come true.

WHAT DID NEW YORK CITY REPRESENT FOR A YOUNG JAZZMAN? A PLACE TO BE?

When I was ten years old my parents decided to move to New York City from my birthplace of Jacksonville, Florida. Just after arriving, my mother entered me in the famous Apollo Theater “Amateur Hour”. During those, the early fifties, almost all contestants were singers. I was the only instrumentist ! But I placed at the top. The song I played ‘Because Of You’. Also during these years if you placed at the top, your reward was a work experience with the Red Prysock Orchestra.

WHAT WERE YOUR FIRST IMPRESSIONS OF THE CITY ? YOU LIVED AT FIRST IN HARLEM, THEN IN BROOKLYN: WHAT WERE THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THOSE TWO PARTS OF THE CITY?

Of course for a child that age schooling and getting to know the city occupied most of teenage years. Around eleven/twelve, my mother’s brother had a lot of hip LPs which I occupied myself listening to. I had already been doing that since the age of six/seven at home, in Jacksonville. My mother’s father had original 78 rpms Jazz At The Philharmonic presentations of Norman Granz, which I was already “scatting” to. So I knew what was hip and what was ‘has been’ by the age of eight, so amongst those LPs of my uncle I discovered Max Roach and Clifford Brown At Basin Street on EmArcy. I knew immediately that it was just about the hippest thing I’d ever heard and right there I made the decision that this would be my life’s work. So between eleven/twelve until graduation from high school at seventeen years of age, most of my working hours were spent listening to everything.

YOU PLAYED AS A SIDEMAN, AND FURTHER AS A LEADER, DURING THE SIXTIES… WHAT WERE YOUR MAIN INFLUENCES? JACKIE MCLEAN? MAX ROACH? DIZZY?

My main influence, until I found Clifford Brown, was Charlie Shavers at that point. New York’s Harlem where I grew up was a sort of paradise. From my house located on 137street & eight avenue, I was in walking distance of two main jam session spots : Count Basie’s bar and a place called Brankers. It was at those two places that musicians young and old came on Monday nights to be heard in the hope of getting in and being accepted into the scene. I didn’t participate yet, just listened. I went away to Washington, between eighteen and twenty one, but I decided in 1963 to return home because I felt I was ready to participate. My family had moved to Brooklyn and there was a club in that part of town named Blue Coronet where many soon-to-be major figures were playing. I too jammed there and one night I met a fella named Jim Harrison who had started his own Jackie McLean Fan Club. He told me that maybe Jackie McLean was looking for a new trumpeter and that I should go see him. He gave me his contact, and I went to meet him. The rest is history ! Without having barely, if at all, heard what he sounded like, Jackie put me on his next recording for Blue Note : It’s Time. That changed my life forever.

YOU WERE (WITH WOODY SHAW) ONE OF THE CATS ON TRUMPET… HOW COULD YOU EXPLAIN THE FACT RECORD COMPANIES DIDN’T OFFER TO YOU A GOOD DEAL?

For the next couple of years, I performed and recorded with Jackie. He was my mentor into the scene. It was also during this period that Alfred Lions sold his masterpiece, Blue Note Records, to Transamerica Corp/United Artist. Both myself and Woody Shaw had been placed on significant Blue Note recordings but for some reason Alfred Lions would not give us a record session of our own, which had been up to that point what usually happened with young lions trumpeters brought in by established stars within the label, and that is you would be given your own recording as leader. It would take Woody Shaw nearly five more years before he got his chance with Columbia, curtailing Dexter Gordon.

IN THE EARLY SEVENTIES, WHAT WAS THE PLACE OF JAZZ IN THE MUSIC BUSINESS? WAS IT HARDER AND HARDER FOR YOUNG MUSICIANS LIKE YOU?

One cannot be certain, but the last A&R guy of the original Blue Note label, Duke Pearson – himself trumpeter as well as pianist by the way – before Alfred Lions sold the company, perhaps didn’t push for us to record as leaders, as the A&R before him, Ike Quebec, did for Freddie Hubbard. Speaking of Freddie Hubbard, I first met him when he had just arrived to New York. I was seventeen, he was twenty one. Since that moment we were friends and confidants until his death.

THAT WAS WHY YOU DECIDED TO CREATE STRATA EAST?

With respect to recording contracts, it is as much about who in the business, A&R, managers, agents, record label execs, etc. will champion your cause and more often it is those elements more than your artistry which gets you there. As mentioned Woody Shaw, as good as he was, had to wait until the mid seventies before being championed. I decided in 1970 to just go ahead and get involved with the whole process; being a musician artist, composing, arranging, and issuing my recordings with a company I would create. I had already in 1969 made my first LP as a leader for Alan Bates while he was still an executive at Polydor in London, “The Ringer”, featuring my first quartet which included Stanley Cowell.

COULD YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT YOUR PARTNERSHIP WITH STANLEY COWELL ? HOW LONG YOU HAVE KNOWN HIM FOR? WAS HE A KIND OF ALTER EGO? HOW DID YOU WORK TOGETHER?

Stanley Cowell and I met for the first time at the first rehearsal to start the new Max Roach quintet in 1967. From That moment until now we became close friends and confidents. Three years later we decided to record a big band and shop it to the labels that existed at the time, including the major indies. We didn’t find interest, so right then and there I decided we do the whole “9 yards” ourselves. There was not yet the thought of a record label, just get this recording “Music Inc & Big Band” into the market.

WHY DID YOU CHOOSE THIS NAME STRATA EAST? WHAT DOES IT MEAN?

To make a long story short, researching everything about how the industry companies did it, we went about the business of record (LP) in manufacturing of distribution. We didn’t have a name for the label yet, but Stanley knew some musician colleagues in Detroit, Michigan – The Contemporary Jazz Quintet, Kenny Cox/Charles Moore – who had already started a musician-owned music production company named Strata. We decided to call our operations Strata East, meaning the eastern side of the USA for Strata. We were completely separate companies but ideologically linked : “musician owned”. Strata East was born.

WAS IT A KIND OF COOPERATIVE ? ALTERNATIVE? AND DID YOU CHOOSE WHO YOU SIGNED?

Back to making a long story shorter : the jazz radio disc-jokeys at a radio station at the time WLIB started playing the LP and we slowly started getting small orders from “Mom & Pops” one-stop distributors, and we also distributed through another musician run company JCOA headed by Carla Bley and Mike Mantler which lasted for several years. Other musicians, some known, some unknown, began asking how we did it and could they join. I decided there would be no artist under contract. The artist would have to produce his own product just as Stanley and I had. We, Strata East, would serve as their conduit to the market place with 70/80 payback to them. IT WAS A GOOD DEAL… Some people thought it was a crazy idea… The traditional thought being that if you start a record label – and you want to make money – you put an artist under contractual control. I and Stanley decided that since out of necessity we had financed our LP which launched the label, we not only owned the masters but if we let others join so too would they own their masters since the requirement to join was them having already financed their recording thus become the major recipient of the proceeds. The result of this idea didn’t really become apparent until we issued Gil Scott-Heron’s “Winter in America”.

SCOTT-HERON, CLIFFORD JORDAN, CECIL MC BEE, HEATH BROTHERS… WHAT WAS THE LINK BETWEEN ALL THESE MUSICIANS?  WAS THERE A SORT OF ARTISTIC DIRECTION? ESTHAETIC LINE?

Prior to Gil Scott-Heron’s product, the artist who really contributed much to the Strata East formula was Clifford Jordan who in essence had already busied himself with producing at least four products which he was to bring to the label. Then many of our colleagues joined : like you mentioned, the bass player Cecil McBee, the brotherhood Heath –Jimmy, Percy and Tootie –, Bill Lee, Spike’s father, the Monk’s saxophonist Charlie Rouse, Billy Harper and many others…

YOUR EXPOSURE CHANGED AFTER THE SUCESS OF WINTER IN AMERICA. HOW MANY RECORDS DID YOU PUT OUT ON STRATA EAST IN THE END?

With the success of Scott-Heron, the “major recipient” idea quickly caught until at one point we were carrying fifty titles through 1982. From the inception of Strata East in 1971 until 1982 I kept things going while still performing both with the quartet and occasionally with large ensembles. I kept the label going by leasing to many companies throughout Europe, Scandinavia and Japan. By doing so the LPs always found their way back to America and into the retail store that were alive in those hey days, I.C., Tower, HMV, etc.

MOST OF US ARE FASCINATED BY THE STRATA EAST RECORD LABEL. THERE IS ONE PARTICULAR RECORD FROM THAT CATALOGUE THAT HAS REMAINED MYSTERIOUS TO US. IT’S JOHN GORDON’S “EROTICA SUITE” FROM 1978. CAN YOU TELL US ANYTHING ABOUT THIS RECORD?

John Gordon & I became colleagues in a loft we shared around the corner from the storied 89 East Broadway loft both of which were a vital part of the mid-sixties loft jazz scene melting pot for new modern be-bop players and new avant garde players. Some years after Stanley & I got the label going John decided to join and the result was his “Erotica Suite” (and before that “Step By Step” published in 1976) which we also performed on. It is still a recording I very much enjoy. Sadly John passed away some years ago.

GENERALLY SPEAKING WHY ARE SOME OF THE STRATA EAST RECORDS SO RARE? I THINK ABOUT BILLY PARKER’S FOURTH WORLD, SHAMEK FARRAH, MBOOM PERCUSSIONS…

Generally speaking many of the Strata East recordings are rare now because they were one-off recordings by the artist who afterwards disappeared from the scene never to return. Billy Parker (Fourth World) and Shamek Farah by example. In the case of MBoom the anticipated release on Strata East never materialized because the participants decided to release it elsewhere. Mboom was a collective group essentially all leaders of it.

WERE COPIES DESTROYED OR WAS THERE JUST NO ENOUGH BELIEF IN THEIR COMMERCIAL SUCCESS AT THAT TIME?

Any LP copies of commercially released Strata East recordings were never destroyed. At the end of a deal with any particular artist that artist was given their masters and any LPs that may have been left in stock to sell for themselves. No deal was ever made with any artist based on whether or not it would be a commercial success. It was made because the artist wanted and needed to have a product commercially issued and came to us to help them accomplish that. Obviously some were more successful than others.

BY THE WAY, YOU STILL LISTEN TO YOUR OLD RECORDS? ON LP?

Rarely do I listen to my own vintage LPs because I don’t want to damage them with the needle. I do from time to time listen to them on CD issues.

AND WHAT WAS HAPPENING AT THE END OF THE SEVENTIES? WHY DID THE STRATA EAST ADVENTURE FADE AWAY? YOU DISAPPEARED DURING THE EIGHTIES BUT YOUR NAME AND THE STRATA EAST LABEL WERE STILL WELL KNOWN BY MUSIC LOVERS…

After 1982, I decided to rest things for a while. Strata East never ceased ! As long as I am alive it lives. The cult thing about the label started to happen long before the demise of the LP because I operated very quietly, no fanfare. So people were always wondering what happened to Strata East. Well, it wasn’t the traditional record operation although it facially had the look of an up and running operation. In 1989 I retooled the masters of myself and Stanley and a few other original colleagues of the label, and reissued some twenty five recordings of the catalogue on CD. Those CDs found their way to the market exactly as I had done before, by leasing overseas and they found their way back to the USA stores. Younger musicians and entrepreneurs who have taken a look at the Strata East model are now issuing their recordings with that model in mind. You own your own master and you should be the “major recipient”.

(c) Jimmy Katz

BACK TO THE EIGHTIES. IT WAS A NEW AGE OF JAZZ : WYNTON MARSALIS, AND YOUNG TRADITIONNAL CATS ; HOW DID YOU LOOK AT THIS PHENOMENA? A KIND OF COME-BACK TO THE PAST? A FAKE IDEA?

With respect to a new age of jazz unless newer musicians have assimilated the original giants, what is called new age means nothing. And one can hear that in a lot of them. I’m not unhappy with the state of things however for there are a few of us still “taking no prisoners” on the bandstand keeping things honest. The superiority of the originals still reigns supreme.

LAST BUT NOT LEAST, YOU PLAYED IN JAZZ AT LINCOLN CENTER END OF OCTOBER 2011 FOR A TRIBUTE TO COLTRANE’S AFRICA BRASS…

The Africa Brass thing is an idea of Reggie Workman. The original scores by Eric Dolphy were long ago lost. I resurrected them from the grooves of the LPs and created additional choir to it. This was presented like that at Lincoln Center.

DO YOU THINK, AFTER ALL THOSE YEARS, THE HOLY GHOST OF COLTRANE STILL HAUNTING ALL THE JAZZ?

You know, John Coltrane still is and will always be the last definitive model for this music, far superior to the brand new generations. And I have always been on the disciples to carry that enduring message.

YOU CAME BACK AFTER TWENTY FIVE YEARS IN FRONT OF JAZZ ON BLUE NOTE RECORDS, THE LABEL WHERE YOU BEGAN TO RECORD IN SIXTIES… HOW DO YOU LOOK AT THIS LOOP? AND WHAT DID IT CHANGE AFTER ALL THOSE YEARS?

Lastly, I did the recent Blue Note to prove a point. A major record operation if it so chooses – that is, follow the wishes of its president – can make any recording FLY. Not even Bruce Lundvall (former boss) could save the original intent of Blue Note once EMI was monopolized by Terra Firma.

YOU ARE CELEBRATING YOUR FIFTIETH CAREER ANNIVERSARY IN 2014. WHAT STAGE PROJECTS DO YOU HAVE?

For the coming 2014 celebration of my fiftieth year I will perform on stage as I began my career with the small combo format, quartet and sometimes quintet. It is where I have always lived no matter my occasional run with the big band format. First I will be introducing my new combo featuring a great relatively new guitarist Bruce Edwards, a great new young pianist Theo Hill, a great new young bassist Devin Starks, and the great seasoned former Herbie Hancock drummer Gene Jackson.

FOR THIS ANNIVERSARY, WOULD NOT IT BE THE OPPORTUNITY ALSO TO PUBLISH A BOXSET OF YOUR ACTIVITY ON STRATA EAST? FOR INSTANCE ON MOSAIC?

Mosaic and Strata East have released two 3CDsets of me which one could say is like a boxset together : Mosaic Select 20 which is a combination of “Live at Slugs Vol. I & II” and “Live in Tokyo”, and Mosaic Select 37 which is a combination of three recordings – the 1970 recording which launched Strata East, “Music Inc & Big Band” (See here TV Show jazz session in Paris 1971), the 1975 big band recording “Impact”, and a 1979 recording made with the NDR radio jazz orchestra. We’ll see what else we collaborate on for the near future.

COULD WE IMAGINE A TOUR IN DUET WITH STANLEY COWELL?

At some point during the year perhaps my colleague Stanley will join me to reprise the quartet Music Inc.

DID NEW YORK CHANGE AFTER ALL THESE YEARS?

New York indeed has changed since I debuted in 1964. For one thing only a handful (if that) of the original modern jazz innovators and the generation before me are still alive. New players like when I came along could rub shoulders with those giants every night because there were so many of them playing the New York club scene. You could hear and see them live, meet them, and maybe get a chance to perform with them if they liked what you were doing. The scenario for that has changed.